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*Date*: Thu, 24 Jun 2004 14:25:42 +0200*From*: Jeroen Van der Veken <Jeroen.VanderVeken@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>*Subject*: Re: save failed

I found out when the problem happens. It's when I copy and paste a macro and then change something inside the macro (especcialy changing names of variables in an equation). After this, Isibat refuses to save, but exploding and recreating the macro solves that problem. My beautiful connection allignment is gone, but at least it works :) greetings, Jeroen Bin Li wrote: Hi, Jeroen Van der, I can't agree with you any more. I met exactly the same terrible problems before when I was trying to save some files, especially when there were some macros in the projects. That was like a nightmare. :( It seems that IISiBat doesn't like Macro. Here is my clumsy method, but at least it works for me: Never copy/paste macro. Whenever you have to do it, explode it at first. And then copy/paste the subcomponents to anywhere you want. Make use you save the project before you use macro again. Bin-----Original Message----- From: owner-trnsys@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-trnsys@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Jeroen Van der Veken Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2004 2:10 PM To: trnsys@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: negative solar radiation the component order : 13 equations, mainly used to control the radiators and the heater 3 type 9's type 33e type 16h type 69 type 56 type 41 (schedule) 5 type 14 (day/night schedules) 5 on/off controllers (for shading system) 40 tubes, diverters and tee pieces type 3d (pump) type 6 (ideal heater) 9 times a radiator system with type 137 (PID-controller), tubes, diverter, tee piece, type 177 (mix of 180 and 80), type 65 2 type 93 (value recall of zone temperatures, to send to the ambient temperature input of the PID-controllers, radiators and tubes and use for ventilation air temperature in toilet and bath room.) type 25c probably this is not really helping you much, I will sent you the TPF and relating files. I tried to create a macro of the whole system and copy/paste that to an empty project, but then my computer crashed, and my file was lost forever. When Isibat refuses to save it is also quite unstable. Even saving every five minutes on the hard disk and on a memory stick doesn't help much, as the file on the memory stick can be opened but can't be saved either. What do you mean with replicate the error ? I can't save it when it happens, since that is the problem... I will download the updated version of the Isibat, maybe that will help... Jeff Thornton wrote:At 02:50 PM 6/15/2004 +0200, you wrote:That is no problem anymore if I lower the timestep to 0.1 hour and less, and/or reduce the power of the radiation. However, with smaller timesteps I get the error ***** ERROR ***** UNIT 20 TYP # 56 NEGATIVE VALUE OF SOLAR RADIATION FOR 5. ORIENTATION ENCOUNTERED. SIMULATION STOPPED. If I follow the radiation from the radiation processor, this doesn't seem the case. It seems that the problem is in Type56.This can happen sometimes if the component order in IISiBat isn't ideal. We've noticed it a few times when we have Type 16 followed by Type 56 followed by a Type 34 shading device. Type 56 gets the incidence angle from Type 16 and an older value of radiation from Type 34 at the first iteration and errors out. Check for situations like this.And to make it really frustrating, TRNSYS doesn't appear to like my TPF-files and announces from time to time when I want to save the project "save failed". Trying to save it on another disk or diskette doesn't work and when I reboot my computer, the whole file seems to have dissapeared from the hard disk. Not only the latest changes, the whole thing.If that happens, copy everything in the project and paste it to a new project - then save the new project. Can you replicate the error so we can forward it on to the IISiBat developers? Jeff****************************************************************** ***************Thermal Energy System Specialists (TESS) Jeff Thornton 2916 Marketplace Drive Principal Suite 104 Phone: (608) 274-2577 Madison WI 53719 Fax: (608) 278-1475 USA E-mail: thornton@xxxxxxxxxxxx Web Page: www.tess-inc.com "Providing software solutions for today's energy engineering projects"****************************************************************** *************** |

**Attachment:
gbou_rij_K55_radiatoren7.TPF**

#ESI! 1.0 TYPE137 0 1 2 2 25/5/2004 25/5/2004 1 noowner 1 0 1 1 1 1 0 NMF 1 0 NMF 1 1 C:\Trnsys15\Types\TYPE137.FOR TRNSYS 13 Setting Value SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 45 0 - dimensionless Feedback variable SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 12 0 - dimensionless ERO SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 - SIO SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 - DES SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 Actuator output SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 - dimensionless Proportional action SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 - dimensionless Integral action SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 - dimensionless differential action SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 - dimensionless Proportional Gain SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 3 0 - dimensionless Integral Gain SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 1.5 0 - dimensionless Differential Gain SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 4.5 0 - dimensionless Controller Mode SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] -1 0 - dimensionless 0 0 0 0 0 *** trnModel specific properties *** 9999 137 0 0 0 0 0 6 0 0 0 0 0 4 Proportional Gain Integral Gain Differential Gain Controller Mode 0 0 4 0 1 100 0 3 0 1 100 0 3 0 1 100 -1 -1 0 1 100

#ESI! 1.0 type 177 0 1 2 2 5/6/2004 5/6/2004 1 noowner 1 0 1 1 1 1 0 NMF 1 0 NMF 1 1 C:\Trnsys15\EL2EP_types\Type177.for TRNSYS 14 Cp SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 4.187 0 - dimensionless Radiator mode SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 1 0 - dimensionless Nominal Power SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 5000 0 - dimensionless Radiator exponent SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 1.3 0 - dimensionless Radiator thermal capacitance SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 67.87 0 - dimensionless Tolerance SN 1 simple real 3 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0.001 0 - dimensionless radiator temperature SN 1 simple real 5 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 40 0 - dimensionless water supply temperature SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 68 0 C Temperature ambient temperature SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 20 0 C Temperature mass flow rate SN 1 simple real 1 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 kg/hr Flow Rate water exhaust temperature SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 38 0 - dimensionless water mass flow rate SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 kg/hr Flow Rate power emitted by radiator SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 5000 0 - dimensionless power injected in radiator SN 1 simple real 2 + -Inf +Inf [ ; ] 0 0 - dimensionless 0 0 0 0 0 *** trnModel specific properties *** 9999 177 0 0 0 0 0 6 0 0 0 0 0 6 Cp Radiator mode Nominal Power Radiator exponent Radiator thermal capacitance Tolerance 0 0 2 0 1 100 0 3 0 1 100 0 5 0 1 100 0 0 0 1 100

**References**:**RE: negative solar radiation***From:*Bin Li

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